146625-exile-bias
Content ---- It is a real shame. The Cassians have some awesome characters (Zin, Doon, Antevian, etc) and the Dominion has such a rich history and context (lore wise) Mechari foot wear and voices (and chua undies) aside, The Dominion really could use some love from the PR department, and there is so much love to give. | |} ---- ---- ---- I agree, but more in the sense of "it sure would be nice if the Exiles had one race where the females didn't just look like tiny-waisted, inexplicibly-more-human versions of the males with breasts slapped on because sure, that makes complete sense for lizards, or robots, or ROCKS." I'll never get over how dumb that is. | |} ---- ---- Haha, a band of space criminals and terrorists are the good guys? Human exiles; bloody surprise attack killing scores of their fellow citizens | Granok; defiled the ways of their people, banished to eternal exile... also responded to the offer of extreme wealth and partnership in the Dominion by killing it's diplomats | Mordesh; literally drove their own species to virtual extinction and destroyed all life on their planet through hubris and playing god | Aurin; raise and eat thinking, feeling, sentient and sapient creatures to eat (Veggies). The Dominion, while just as fallible as any other group, strives to unite the galaxy in peace and order... remind me again who the "good guys" are? | |} ---- Okay I came again. Aaaaand I dont care about a pvp set. I will admit the Dominion sets do look a lot cooler but then everything looks cooler for the Dominion. That's not the case at all for the Mechari, and them and the Draken look great so I dont know what you are complaining about here. Granok maybe, but they look retarded anyway. Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- They all look cupcaking awesome (Dom) EXCEPT, for medics.... WTF Carbine, we are techno healers, what kind of look were you going for with that :/ Exile stalker set looks like it would make a good Medic set... or something similar just swap the blue with red .... *sigh* | |} ---- I went and looked and yeah, the Dominion sets do look a lot cooler, especially the warrior set which is good for me :D and yeah the medic one was the only one I really didnt like. The exiles have a few decent looking ones but otherwise look bad. Fits their aesthetics though :) Also how is the character situation on the Exiles? I have not really played them so I dont know what characters they have but I have heard that their's are much more prominent. Most of the Dominion characters dont really do anything like; Axis Phydra (who I really like), and Mondo Zax. Artemis Xin is cool but she takes all the credit for what we do lol. And then there's agent Lex who shows up every now and then. Just saying that Agent Voxine would be a great addition........ Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- ---- Haha, well to be fair Zin does do some cool stuff too (And all the characters on both sides tend to take credit for what we do). IMO the Exile characters are kinda weak. Judge kain is kinda... really boring. Belle Walker is ok, but a huge ditz. Brightland is emo...Durek literally has boulders for brains.... I mean I can see some of the appeal, but compared to the Dom characters like Corrigan Doon, the drunk master thief and adventurer; Kevo the backbone of Zin, and seriously the best character in game, Toric Antevian... they just don't seem to compare.... Dat Toric doe... for real.... | |} ---- ---- ---- Yup, even some of the Highborn and Luminai genuinely care for the lowborn and all citizens (e.g. Aluviel and Cazalon). Of course we have our share of Malvolio's too, but it adds flavor IMO. I especially love when Toric shuts down his higborn officers / soldiers.... | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- I'm a girl and I think Draken need a trip to the dermatologist :o I like the way the clothes look on female human and Aurins. | |} ---- ---- Do you wan't to get Eldan Tex? Because that's how you get Eldan... Edited November 9, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- ---- Dont be jealous that Draken girls are hotter.\ Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- One thing to keep in mind, Thayd is much more densely packed than Illium. In Thayd, the portal ships, the contracts, the daily quest givers, the AH, the CX, the Guild Management and the Crafting and Runing Stations are all within eyeshot of each other. So you can see *every single player* in one quick jaunt. Illium is so spread out, it's possible to see the cluster at the Contracts area, but not the AH/CX around the corner and certainly not the Crafting/Runing area, much less the spread-out-all-over portal ships. | |} ---- Not "aurin-sided?" Ah, if only it were lopp-sided. Anyhow. While yes, the Exiles are used for the "cool rebel" ethos and hints of Firefly in the advertisement, as someone who is playing both factions within the game itself, they seem to get about even attention. Both factions are the good guys. Both factions are the bad guys. Both factions are about even for "cool" factor. This is very much a "spaghetti space western" and not a "white hat/black hat space western." Well, to be honest, Cowboy Bebop. Or Firefly before the film the central government took a turn for overall Evil well past the petty evils of the protagonists. Narratively, and within the questing story, both factions are on par for being justified, and both factions are on par for being Bad. This is good. Really, the only place I could possibly see a mis-alignment is in the advertisements, but that's mainly an element of wanting to play to familiar story tropes for those who haven't looked at the game at all yet. Once you're here, both factions have a lot to offer aesthetically, narratively, and "morally" for player identification and buy-in. That's actually a rare balance, where most games give one faction the "black hat" and the other faction the "white hat" either from the start Star Wars, or eventually WarCraft. Edited November 9, 2015 by Gnapoleon | |} ---- |} Yeah sadly our sets look like garbage, Domis are way better. I really hope that fix it or atleast let us choose what set we want. | |} ---- Except we have a race with only one gender, no voices for Mechari, no guards in Ilium, the lore, etc. And the advertising doesnt even make sense. Why show off the faction that has the much larger population the most? So we can have MORE AURIN? Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- ---- ---- Too be fair, Chua do have two genders / sexes they just don't have visible sexual dimorphism I could do with out the grody undies though... | |} ---- Im aware of that. In this context thought they dont. My point is that the dominion misses out on customization for no real reason. Although I suppose Aurin dont have 2 genders either. Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- In what possible way are intensely ill rotting twig people badass? Draken definitely take that cake hands down (not literally, pick your hands off the ground Mordesh!!!) Out of all the races, only an exile one has actually completely driven a sentient species to virtual extinction ;3 Edited November 9, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- Y U JEALOUS THO | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- If it makes you feel better, I typed it twice and finally decided against it. :lol: | |} ---- ---- Lol yes we have guards, but not nearly as many as the Exiles do for some reason, and for some reason they arent around critical areas like THE CONTRACT BOARD. So basically any group of Aurin stalkers can just walk in and kill anyone thats flagged who happens to be around those areas. Try that in Thayd. Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- Has that ever actually happened? I have seen Dommies in Thayd before, but never the other way around. I mean, not that it *matters* ... but that's one thing that always aggravated me about WildStar. My favorite times in WoW involved taking a raid (or two) into Stormwind or Ironforge and just taking over. We have nothing comparable to that here and it's pretty damn lamesauce. | |} ---- The species with no sexual dimorphism chua isn't a disadvantage, really. Per discussion elsewhere, while it is rare in video games growing less so to not have extreme sexualization of characters, it's not unwelcome to everyone. I do like one suggestion, though, of having chua able to wear either the "female" or the "male" versions of wardrobe items, rather than simply an "in between" version. While it doesn't make much difference at all to the combat armours, it could make a difference for civilian non-combat costume items, and could be especially fun if the players didn't try to restrict themselves to one or the other, but allowed chue of both sexes to wear both. Regardless, chua not having to be either breasts or shoulders, depending on player choice? Not really a down-side, to my mind. Mechari voices? I suppose that shows how I usually play with the sound low or off. I didn't realize the mechari voice emotes had no voices. And really, mechari voice emotes could be as simple as sampling a bit of the old modem chatter to play during speeches. It wouldn't even need a voice actor. Guards? Like Tex, I've seen lots of guards, but I have not been thinking specifically in terms of PvP "ganking," as my play-time is mostly on a PvE server. As for the lore, as I've mentioned elsewhere above?, both factions in the setting come off as sympathetic, if you read or play both factions. Both factions come off as justified, if you read or play both factions. Both factions have individuals and groups that have done Bad, if you read and play both factions. Both factions are "grey hat" if you read and play both factions. Both factions are "winning" if you read and play both factions. Both factions are "losing" if you read and play both factions. Both factions have "cool" factor, if you read and play both factions. Neither faction has an exclusive claim on being the hero or the villain. Spaghetti Western, remember. Lots of "grey hats." As for the advertising, it's fairly obviously because their target market find the rebel underdogs a cool hook that will lure them to the game, where they can discover both factions. You can thank things like Star Wars, Firefly, V for Vendetta, Dune, A Song of Ice and Fire; there are lots of currently popular stories in Speculative Fiction which hold up the plucky rebel underdog of questionable morals. It's an obvious target for advertising. | |} ---- What would female / male versions of chua gear look like? They don't have seperate gender roles, What does a girly hamster look like? Every other hamster... I would just suggest a neutral pair of undies. the rest of the gear is fine though. Mechari aren't robots... they are sentient exanite crystals housed in prosthetic bodies.... They have voices, souls, etc. They should all get VO's just like Voxine, Lex, Pheydra, etc. And yes, let them wear shoes. I get they are really heavy and have metal feet, but F'in Granok are made of stone and can handle shoes, Mechari can too. And some of those examples (esp. SoI&F and Dune) are a stretch; the protaginists in each tend to be if not directly in control of vast powerful armies, descended from royalty that did, and eventually do command legions to conquer and control as they see fit. Just my 2 cents :3 | |} ---- Well, what would a "boyish" space hamster look like? The girly one is obviously the one we all have now. The sexually-dimorphic and exaggeratedly MALE one is obviously the one we're missing, right? yes, space-opera and other SF underdogs often end up with their own great winning empires - the ragtag misfits in Star Wars eventually have the massive Rebel Alliance taking on Imperial fleets directly - but that initial rebel underdog trope still seems to hold a lot of appeal. | |} ---- Think there's only two guards over there... and they're out of range of all the vendors. Don't want to give out Dominion secrets or anything, but there's a lot of unguarded areas in Illium that make flagged players vulnerable. No need to change how their gear looks. They didn't with Asura and Charr females in Guild Wars 2. All they'd really need to do is add a feminine VO to the female choice. In defense of Granok feet being made of stone, their feet don't have a third toe coming from their heel, or a heel spike in the females. Their feet look as normal as your feet. That said, I prefer my Mechari girl's heel in the satisfaction of how painful it must feel to get kicked in the kidneys with a 4- to 6-inch heel spike. Hell, I say get rid of their shoes altogether. Give 'em Rowsdower leg warmers instead of slippers, that sort of thing. | |} ---- ---- Sarcasm? most of the Chua faces bar one would be labelled "male" by our standards, and the other two are generic and only marginally feminine because of eye size / shape. But add it with pink fur and no facial hair and bam. The Rebel alliance was never massive, the won based on the same silly plot device every time... Who was talking about plot armour before :D ?? | |} ---- | |} ---- This may be the most ignorant thing I've read in a while (ignorant in the actual meaning of the word, not as an insult). I'm guessing you've not yet experienced any substantial part of the actual Dominion storylines? I suggest you try them out, you'll learn very fast your ideas about the factions are wholly lacking. Seriously, try them out, you don't know what you're missing! | |} ---- The Chua run animation is one of the better ones IMO. especially with resonators of pistols drawn! | |} ---- The Exiles are just as much bad as Dominion are good. Play both sides and see for yourself. That would be fine... if it indeed does hide your FEET, rather than the entire boot like it does now. Until then, though, I will continue to support my bare robot feet and the heel spike being thrust into kidneys. | |} ---- I play aurin males. I am a male. :) I think the animations for them is very polished, I like the way they look, etc. Not into playing humans, was not interested in granok, mordesh are cool, but did not want to be one (could not get it past level 5). For dominion I have a chua medic that is level 15 or so. My original plan was to have a draken male for my dominion main, but hate the hunched over look, so made a chua that i can kind of tolerate. (same reason I could never play a dwarf in DDO - they waddle. It irritated me. I played halflings all the time btw, so again, i like smaller races). While I love the vids with the Mechari, i never wanted to be one. So that leaves : Aurin! :) | |} ---- i have and within the first couple of mission it was kill the innocent people and creatures for the dominion!!! like really? the dommi just want to rule over everything and the exiles just want to be left alone.... im sorry how is that a bad thing lol? but like i said MOSTLY its a bad vs good thing both sides at small times show their ugly/nice face but on the grand scale its exiles good - dommi bad. | |} ---- The first mission for the Dominion is a scientific expedition to Levian bay that gets attacked by Exile saboteurs. (going the Levian Bay - Ellevar route). During the attack you even find a Cassian Medic saving an aurin soldier; they have a substantial dialogue... The Dominion want's to unite the galaxy in peace and order, and believe it is the will of their literal gods (the Eldan) that they do so. Here's what CRBHernCO said about this topic (from his lore drop on reddit): "The main conflict in the game is between the Dominion, who believe their gods (the Eldan) granted them the galaxy to rule in the name of peace, law, and justice; and the Exiles, who have banded together to oppose them - or just survive. The Dominion isn't inherently evil and the Exiles aren't inherently good, they just have opposing beliefs about what's best for the universe, and they feel very strongly about it." EDIT: also from HernCO, same source: "This is a misunderstanding of how the Dominion generally operates. They're not the Star Wars evil empire, blowing up planets to keep the local systems in line. They're trying to bring peace to a chaotic galaxy through law and order, and they believe their actual, literal gods (the Eldan) gave them a mission to do so." Edited November 9, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- i know the convo you speak of and in that same convo the aurin asks why to keep him alive as the dommi are only going to torture him for info and the doc says thats not their call. this falls in yes the doc has a heart because they are healing the dommi but also can be seen as bad because they know the outcome of why they are healing them. so if my belief says that im right to rule and youre to be my subordinate then im in no fault if i try to take over your planets and force you to do so even though you dont wish to... thats what youre saying right? FORCING some one to live by YOUR beliefs when they DONT WANT TO is BAD lol. the dommi see themselves are the people to rule and bring law to the universe and the exiles dont want any of it but are being FORCED to do so... yeah im calling the exiles good guys and dommi the bad guys xD | |} ---- I love the chua run animation, although i find it a bit odd they run with their mouth open. My main issue with chua is i cant play stalker, which imo is just bogus. | |} ---- The Mechari have the least reason of all for gender differences. Why were high-heels built into the female feet? Why do they have breasts? Why do they wear lipstick? It's ridiculous. Also, it would make more sense for the female Draken to be hunched over than the male Draken. They actually have extra weight on their chest to bring them down. If you think they "look great", then hey, difference of opinion. But let's not pretend their designs are anything but sexualization. | |} ---- Edited November 9, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- The mechari were intentionally designed that way to more comfortably interface with organic lifeforms that displayed similar sexual characteristics. And Mechari soul cores DO have inherent gender / points on the gender spectrum. They are living beings just like any other, they just happen to be living crystal... | |} ---- You read that wrong. I made a draken but could not play him because of the hunch thing. Similar to how I could not play a dwarf in ddo because they waddle. I made a chua that i can tolerate, thus he is level 16 and not deleted like teh draken. :) | |} ---- No I understood, was just adding my two cents since you mentioned the small character waddle. Used to get me all the time on my Taru in FFXI (where are my knees!!!!)... Chua are surprisingly good though as far as short races go with their movements IMO Edited November 9, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- So basically you want the Draken, Mechari, and Granoks to be like the Chua where the males and females are indistinguishable? That would suck. | |} ---- Pretty sure that's not what was being said. Draken are not just sexually diamorphic ... they are basically two entirely different races. That is how wildly different the males and female are. Mechari get a pass because (according to Lore) they were created to resemble Cassian Humans, so they would be easier to accept as instructors/protectors created by the Eldan. (Copout, as poster above pointed out, but acceptable) But Granok. Holy hells, don't get me started. What the HELL does a female made from ROCK have giant bouncing breasts? First, they are ROCK, so they obviously don't lactate. Second, they are ROCK and don't age or grow. Third, they are ROCK and don't freaking need secondary sexual organs because they don't freaking breed like humans! Now, don't get me wrong. I love all our races for one reason or another, but the logic and lore behind some of the design choices is pretty odd, to say the least. Edited November 9, 2015 by Tex Arcana | |} ---- That's such an obvious copout answer, though, because in any race with similar sexual characteristics, you could have just sent one "male" Mechari and it would have made no difference. Of all the races that are playable in the game (not counting Mechari), five out of six have male and female genders, and the sixth has no visible distinction between the two genders. The only "all-female" race I've seen is only all-female because they're all basically immortal, and they were "created" by the Eldan's interference, anyway. And given the sheer number of Mechari, where are the Mechari that were designed to interact with species like the Chua? Did the Eldan not know that there were species out there that didn't all have a binary look between "men" and "women", or did they think that wasting half their time building a "second gender" under the assumption that they would run into a bunch of worlds either made of all-females or ruled by females was worth more than building a smaller, less-intimidating Mechari? It's obvious that Mechari design came first, and Mechari lore came after. The developers built breasts, and then they asked themselves, "okay, why do they have breasts?" | |} ---- How many animals have you ever seen? Have you ever noticed that there are differences between males and females in species of animals that aren't just "this gender has BREASTS and WIDE HIPS and HEELS and LIPSTICK"? You can make genders distinguishable without making the differences entirely human. All the developers did was make anthropomorphic rocks, lizards, and machines. | |} ---- Why do you keep calling differing opinions 'jealous'? Makes you sound defensive which, IMO, isn't a good way to show for the Dominion. Which, by the way, I have a few. | |} ---- It really is spread too far out and getting around is pretty bad :( Who had the "Tell me about the capital cities" thread going? Was it Caydiem? | |} ---- Probably better than how Carbine does it with their cinematics. "Just because our alien women are hotter doesn't mean you have to be jealous! You can be one of them! Join the Dominion today!" | |} ---- ---- ---- We touched on this in the Eldan Appearance thread in the Lore section. I wouldn't be surprised if the Eldan tampered with a lot of other species - some ancient Eldan pervertsartists deciding to make a bunch of evolving races more... aesthetically pleasing would explain why so many unrelated sentient races all happen to have the same "sexy" shapes for males and females as (assuming Drusera and the Caretaker resemble their creators) the Eldan themselves. | |} ---- I tend to play Exile more than Dominion, but I agree with this. Well, except for the bit about aurin, because my enjoyment of the game doesn't depend on what other players choose to play. The problem is Carbine painted the Dominion as evil from the get go, and have never backed down from that in their advertising. Join the underdog Exiles as they just struggle to have a place to live... or the Dominion who destroy worlds and crush everyone under their boots to bring power and wealth to the small elite of their society. But, you know, whichever is cool. And if a player can get past this, or is into this, then they come up against, as OP mentioned, fewer customization options and unfinished races. If they want to make a chua that clearly reads a masculine, no problem, beards galore! But, if they want to make a chua that reads as feminine... there's pink fur, I guess. And then the mechari with no voices and broken boots... I hate to bring up WoW, but Blizz did make an effort to make both factions a mix of good and bad; neither side was 'the bad guys.' Carbine needs to make it clear, before people start playing, that there's some good to the Dominion. I'm not sure what. But, something. | |} ---- ---- Domi esper looks like a wow paladin. Are you high? Is that what you meant by godlike, powered by the light? | |} ---- Yeah they do like paladins, not to mention the wings on the boots is just hilarious. | |} ---- That's weird because that used to happen all the time. There was as specific group of Aurin stalkers that camped the contract board. | |} ---- Not if you read the lore. In fact it's made pretty clear to all of those. There are very valid reasons for the Mechari having two genders. I suggest you read up on it. And no kidding to the second point, my point is that it doesnt matter. Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- ---- ---- lol Uhh so I make a joke, and you see that as being defensive? The irony here is that you seem like the one that's getting defensive. Why cause you play those dirty Aurin :D? I kid. And I sure hope you are joking about the last part. generalizing an entire population based on the actions of one person? Come on now. Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- It's true that they could just have sent mechari that resembles Cassian men (or women) instead of mechari that resembled both genders. However, considering that the mechari were made for the explicit purpose of interacting with the humans of Cassius, there was absolutely no reason for the eldan to create mechari that resembled chua, draken or any other non-human race. That said, if the eldan had chosen to approach any other race in the same way they approached the humans, it would be thinkable that there are other eldan-made individuals out there that resemble some other alien species. | |} ---- To be fair, it was the Chua who burned down Everroot, and the Chua actually *are* pretty evil (The Zax is, at any rate). The problem is that they are the dominant PR face of the Dominion from the Exiles POV. Levian Bay is probably my favorite starter zone. We find out on the Arkship about how the Dominion are supposedly the chosen people of the Eldan, and then we meet the Caretaker, and he's like "Oh, a Cassian? Well then. Let me unlock the doors for you." I just got the feeling that there was suddenly some weight to this backstory and that it was going to come back later. ps. I really miss the racist hologram rooms on the arkship. Wildstar races are already caricatures of real life, and then we have in-universe caricatures of the caricatures, and I start giggling with glee. | |} ---- Yeah. Was that getting rid of that simply an attempt to convey the Dominion in a better light? Edited November 9, 2015 by Mental Surge | |} ---- Probably. It failed, imo, since it showed how relations between the factions is all about perspective. But maybe that's too subtle for most mmo players (I doubt it). For heaven's sake, there were datachrons in the rooms themselves about how all these stereotypes were wrong, in case anyone missed the joke. | |} ---- I'm interested in lore, so when I ask this, understand that I'm genuinely interested: where is that explicitly stated? Because in every - source - I've found, they say that the Mechari were created to observe and communicate with the other races of the galaxy, and that they were sent, by the Eldans, to various planets throughout space. They don't say that they were designed explicitly to interact with humans, and they don't say why they were designed explicitly to interact with humans-- because they say the Mechari were designed for the purpose of interacting with many races. Edited November 9, 2015 by TheResult | |} ---- Provide sources, please, because I've looked. Nobody can say I didn't try. | |} ---- ---- It isn't explicitly stated. I was misremembering things, sorry. However, we know that mechari can change their appearance and that how they looks also depends on where they were manufactured. Therefore, I still believe that the human-like appearance, of the mechari we know, is a result of them mostly interacting with Cassians and being closest to them, out of all the Dominion races. It makes sense for them to be made in the Cassians' image if they are made on Cassius, like the majority of the race, or mostly deal with Cassians, in the case of the Millennials. If my hypothesis is right, it would be possible that mechari made on other planets might be unrecognisable to us, due to looking like some other alien race. | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- Honestly, I disagree with a lot of points you're making. Yes, Exiles had a large role in the Wildstar Free2Play trailer in terms of screentime. However, I feel that the Dominion came across as more vibrant characters due to their variety and their "Evil Empire" archetype. I imagine the Cassians were left out of the cinematic to prevent confusion with the Exile's humans. As for the Chua phenomenon, I WISH so very badly that I could be an Exile and play as a Chua. While female Chua may be something to consider later on in the development of the game, I think the Chua's appeal is off the charts when compared to the other Dominion races. Mechari not having voices is something I'm not familiar with. The Mechari race never really appealed to me anyways. As someone who frequently 'breaks into' Illium, I slightly agree that your capital city's security is somewhat... lax. However, Illium is LOADS more intricate and beautiful than Thayd which is essentially a bunch of metal walls, some tents and a few dozen vendors. Thayd doesn't have many distinguishing features, so I frequently get lost despite having played for months. Per your final point, the Aurin exist as a prominent 'bait' race. By that, I mean they bring all the closet furries and weebs into Wildstar (don't try to deny it). Notice how they are infinitely more popular than the flagship race for the Exiles, the Granok. Chua exist as the Dominion's flagship race and are by far the most popular, most likely due to their manic and destructive personalities. While I agree that Exiles get more press in some senses, they don't really come across as anything more than the space hillbillies with some fanservice. This is coming from an Exile, btw. In comparison, I feel like the Dominion comes across as the Evil Empire that is staging an actual formulated campaign to oust these space hillbillies. Though, this is entirely subjective. | |} ---- ---- ---- See, people keep saying "LOOK IT UP, IT'S IN THE LORE" but I've read through several sources of lore, and.. nowhere have I seen them say anything about 1) the Mechari's Soul-Cores having anything to do with gender, or 2) the Mechari being explicitly designed to look like Cassians. Instead of just saying "it's there, look for it" (because trust me, I did), would you be so kind as to show me where it says these things? | |} ---- Mondo went out of his way to kill a Chua minion in a small Crimson Isle side quest. Like, full on "YOU HAVE FAILED ME!" villain-mode cold-blooded murder. I like my Draken characters and can enjoy playing them but the Dominion is... pretty much what one can expect from an Evil Empire with some people trying to help its image and a bit more egalitarian in some areas. Even its PR is more about establishing its legitimacy to rule over people it violently conquers and commits genocides against - the whole divine right to rule thing which often serves as justification for imperialist societies. All evidence of Exiles doing bad things I've found have been extreme responses to the extreme threat that the Dominion poses. Sometimes the Black Hoods get downright cruel, sometimes Granok commanders live up to their rock-headed reputations, but overall they're only doing what they're doing to survive against an exterminationist aggressor with vast power at its disposal. Of course it's hard for the Dominion not to be evil since they get so much from the "parents" they also worship. | |} ---- ---- I love my Dommie toons :wub: I have 6 of them. I suppose this is why I think faction barriers on PvE servers are just silly. There is zero reason for anyone on PvE to 'hate' the 'other side'. I can certainly understand not wanting to play an Aurin or a Chua or whatever doesn't please one's personal aesthetic but the whole this or that race is 'dirty' or 'squirrels' or 'flea-ridden' is pretty absurd IMO, of course. I think the main reason I like the Exiles over the Dominion is the "You will obey' attitude that gets my hackles up a bit, but I just roll my eyes and move along. | |} ---- As someone who has been killed by the guards in Illium on several occasions, I have no idea what you mean by this. | |} ---- Like WoW's goblins, the chua seem to be intended to parody industrial revolution England and the United States. Low value of human life, with child labour and low safety protocols for workers, intense resource use, and heady levels of pollution. As a narrative tool, they serve a satiric purpose. We the audience seem intended to draw easy parallels between our own Western industrial history the present day, and see it as a Swiftian satire. In the setting, few other species would consider them evil likely the aurin, but some would consider them amoral. In some ways they parallel the mordesh, with Science! meaning technological discovery trumping any value on life-as-life. Oh, and yes, my comment earlier regarding male/female chua looks was deliberately taking a poke at the sexualization issue, with regards to assumptions that "neutral" means "male," and the idea that "pink" and "huge chested" means "female." With chua body shape being neither triangle nor hourglass, but rectangle, they don't default to 'obviously male' any more than they default to 'obviously female.' And I'm a bit surprised that anyone would assume the voice files are "obviously male" either: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=em4Xfzz01UU Edited November 10, 2015 by Gnapoleon | |} ---- The voice actor for that voice is actually a woman too :P | |} ---- Which makes no sense as there are Humans on the other side, and they're the original ones. | |} ---- Actually, I'm having a browse of the accumulated cinematic trailers again today: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=539r62SO0Ac and here, yes, there is a bias toward advertising the Exiles, and toward promoting the Exiles as "the good guys" versus the Dominion's "the bad guys," which admittedly doesn't entirely support the very grey results in game we see Exile scientists experimenting on the local sentients, Exile assassins, Exile operatives poisoning or infecting swathes of the local environment; and also the Dominion burning the supply pods of an Exile ark-ship, shooting at a mixed crowd of mercenaries and refugees, and spying - both sides support doing terrible things both to each other and to bystanders. This is, seen in retrospect, pretty visibly done for simplicity, and for the "hook" of "plucky underdog against snobby rulers" being an easy narrative to sell in the United States - it is, after all, the mythology built around the American Revolution.* It's concise and can be told through shorthand like giving the Dominion narrator a "British" accent and the Exile narrator an "American rebel" accent. It makes for easy commercials. The first of the trailers that aimed for narrative balance, with both factions being "the good guys" from that perspective, is https://youtu.be/539r62SO0Ac?t=18m36s where both factions' members are seen defending the locals from looters and 'pirates.' * The mythology of the American Revolution is about plucky locals wanting their own government instead of a corrupt Imperial ruler; instead of being about smugglers like John Hancock wanting to stay rich, and land speculators the wealthy and influential owners of the Ohio Company wanting to be allowed to sell land over the mountains that British treaties with the First Nations said 1763 is inviolable. Looking for some good on-the-bus reading on different perspectives of the rebellion? Try http://www.amazon.ca/The-Unknown-American-Revolution-Democracy/dp/014303720X Edited November 10, 2015 by Gnapoleon | |} ---- ---- Sooooo just 'cause the Dominion quest givers will not tolerate failure suddenly makes them evil? And just 'cause you don't see Exile NPCs talking to you in a similar fashion doesn't mean that they tolerate failure. They're probably not as serious about enforcing the consequences of failure like Mondo is with his assistants because the Exiles aren't as expendable. That doesn't make it evil. | |} ---- You also have to sentence the doctor in a quest in Wilderrun, and the choices are... not very good. More on topic, despite being primarily an Exile-player (though I have my fair share of Dominion alts), I definitely sympathize with the perception of bias in Exile favor in WS's advertising. Granted I really enjoyed the F2P trailer, but I can see where Dominion folk are coming from. Would be nice to see another cinematic in the same vein, but done from the perspective of the Dominion team in the video. :) Actually... as per Carbine, they do. Edited November 10, 2015 by Naunet | |} ---- That's the dumbest thing ever then. I always imagined my Granoks were carved out of the stone of their region of creation and infused with life through some ritual or infusion of elemental Earth and Life. Ugh. Lactating rocks that give birth to live young. Seriously? That is pure stupidity and short-sighted cop-out crapola. | |} ---- ---- ---- Marketing assumptions. Look at the development of female trolls over at Blizzard. 1st iteration: http://i58.tinypic.com/2rq0g8m.jpg 2nd iteration: https://bnetcmsus-a.akamaihd.net/cms/content_folder_media/HZPDUAC7OPHK1407871973786.jpg While the males remained monstrous and hunched, the females were straightened and "beautified," admittedly because of the assumption that the target market would not want to watch monstrous or bestial female characters during play. But even the hunched males among the Draken have the point-down triangle body form that is the exaggeratedly-sexualized male. The industry will play catch-up to a more visually and narratively literate audience, but it will rarely take the lead. Which is one of the things I really like about the chua. Female voice acting, male facial hair options, actually neutral body-type. As for the silicon-based lifeforms, the authors here are far from the only to play fast-and-loose "soft SF" with that trope.* Have a browse at http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SiliconBasedLifeto see a wide variety of non-scientifically-plausible and not-well-detailed examples. * Nothing wrong with soft SF, by the way. Thing Wells as opposed to Verne. Wells's soft sci-fi didn't care about demonstrating the engineering of the technology machine, martian invasion walker, it cares about the way human beings act because of said technology. That is entirely valid, and makes up a huge wealth of science fiction going back at least as far as Swift and de Bergerac obviously much farther. Edited November 10, 2015 by Gnapoleon | |} ---- Meh its not a uncommon issue in games though, Troll males are hunched where Troll females are not. My personal preferences is to play non-hunched characters though, although my main in WoW is a male troll rogue but i have to turn off the cloak cause it looks silly. Edited November 10, 2015 by Wolfuse | |} ---- Yeah I'm guessing they just pulled that "Lore" out of their collective butts, slapped it on a webpage and then just expected us to never think about it again. I hate seeing holes in the tapestry. Makes me cranky. | |} ---- you mean like the Aurin will obey the matria? Or the Granok will obey Durek? Every faction has some form of heirarchy, and everyone "obeys" their superior officers / supervisors. This goes as much for the Exiles as it does the Dominon. Maybe you're confusing having laws and a real legal system with "obedience" ? I guess compared to the virtual anarchy of the Exiles having actual laws would seem stuffy. With the doctor & the Aurin, you the player get to chose the doctor who saved the Aurin's fate during her trial... You can let her off easy or condemn her. Fancy that a trial! It's like they have a strict though robust and well maintained legal system to keep law and order in the Dominion... I would humbly suggest the faction that raises, slaughters and eats sapient and sentient organisms (quintessential people) might want to look into some laws of their own? At least maybe take a leaf out of the FDA's book and not eat people (is there a Veggie & soylent green joke in game yet? If not there needs to be....) One last thing about the Cassian Military Doctor and the Aurin. In U.S. Military law (10 U.S. Code § 904 - Art. 104. Aiding the enemy ), a U.S. soldier aiding the enemy: "shall suffer death or such other punishment as a court-martial or military commission may direct." Edited November 10, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- I mean, yeah, and that's a huge part of the problem. It's so.. it's such a copout. It's so lazy and uninnovative and the same. | |} ---- The Exiles have trials, too. Except our trials are literally a minigame in the main city. : ) Also, as far as "is the Dominion evil or not", I think that's just a case of clashing morals. For instance, the blockade around Grismara. That's a whole argument for people to have, all day long: was it okay to just shoot down any ships that tried to get off planet, and let the Mordesh kill themselves out, even though they were your allies just a few moments ago? Was that a "necessary evil"? Are the Exiles any better or worse for sneaking the Mordesh off their planet and bringing a planet-ending disease back into space, and maybe worse, onto the planet that's supposed to be every other race's one chance at a new home? More importantly, how inept are the Dominion for having a planet-wide blockade around Grismara and still allowing SO MANY OF THEM TO ESCAPE? My opinions, in order, are no, no, probably just as bad, and oh my god, incredibly inept, what a bunch of morons. But, y'know, I'm biased. Edited November 10, 2015 by TheResult | |} ---- I meant like it's common to accept a quest and be told "that I must obey". Not some unspoken rules or hierarchy, hell, most people have bosses. I guess it's more like.... I wouldn't be friends with someone that was that condescending to me, particularly when I was helping them. Meh, it's really not that big a deal even if it seems that way :P | |} ---- This is why my dream job is a science consultant for video game devs and other creative productions. xD | |} ---- OOOOOHHHHH!!! No I got you now. Yea some of the Highborn quest givers fancy themselves "highbrow". Though I absolutely love the Chua questgivers.. "Oh you still alive?" Edited November 10, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- There are games that try pushing the boundaries, but they all fall into the gender role trap. WS at least tried in regards to Chua but look at the outrage with that. Trust me i get what you are saying, however on a bigger scale to the industry it doesn't hold up to stretch that much of the imagination otherwise there is a backlash like the Chua issue. DAoC, Everquest, Crowfall, etc honestly I cant think of any game where there was a unique species ,like the Chua, which didn't fall into the gender/beauty trap. In the case of WoW, there were very few female dwarfs compared to any race/gender do to the horrendous facial options. There are far more now since they revamped the character models and added more facial options which were more feminine and beautiful. DAoC and GW2 both had Tree/Plant people with breast to show they were female. Everquest Next has that lion race which most likely the females will have breast as well. Which imo is a bit silly considering you can determine males by having a mane. Crowfall has decent selection in regards to races (which are class locked and some are even gender locked) however they will also have females with breasts. | |} ---- Pretty sure providing medical treatment to a wounded POW does not equate to "aiding the enemy" in US Military law. In fact, I'm fairly certain that is required by international law. And the "let her off easy" option was imprisonment for life. Edited November 10, 2015 by Naunet | |} ---- Generally now it is as you described. But thats a VERY recent addition to U.S. and international law. You can count in decades how long it's been since a military doctor aiding an enemy got the death penalty guaranteed (which they STILL can in certain circumstances). And just because international law dictates something doesn't mean it is so in practice. Just ask Doctors with out borders. In the in game example she was not aiding a wounded combatant who was brought to a Dominion hospital, she was in an active engagement where she was expected to be fulfilling her duties, and was derelict in her role while aiding an enemy soldier still in the field. Even in a modern developed military this would likely bring a court marshal (if not for aiding the enemy, for dereliction of duty). Someone getting life for Treason is a VERY easy sentence even in our world... With good behaviour she'll be out on parole in a couple years ;) Edited November 10, 2015 by Nazryn | |} ---- Rofl oh now i remember that quest, I had the doctor executed :D | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- Hey can we get a female draken in the next trailer, but this time it's favor for dominion dominating Exiles. A long black hair default skin draken at so the viewers can see the epic swooshness of her hair as she dominate her opponent. Warrior or Stalker class at that ;) Thanks :) | |} ---- name her BigBooty Judy....or Thunderthighs Unite. meh I tried to be funny B) Edited November 10, 2015 by Bacon_21 | |} ---- So? Does that make them any less moral? The comparison was made between how the Dominion treats PoWs and how they're treated IRL, and the fact of the matter is... the way the Dominion treats them is not generally acceptable in modern warfare. The Cassian who treated that Aurin was sentenced either to life in prison or execution, for providing medical attention to a captured combatant. I think it's a little misleading to suggest this is similar to what we consider acceptable PoW treatment in real life, regardless of how relatively "recent" the generally agreed upon international terms are. In other words, not really a good defense of the Dominion's actions in that case. Edited November 10, 2015 by Naunet | |} ---- Pretty sure that asking a forum moderator to make sure certain things go into a cinematic or PR project is probably not going to work out for you. :lol: :lol: | |} ---- Chill lol. Draken = Savage that happens to those designs. Perfect name be Tinaka Bloodinz from the Bloodscales tribe. One draken fan can dream :). Never hurt to try and at least they can think about it ;) | |} ---- Of course a forum moderator can think about it but they have zero access to any software to make a trailer happen. What Tex was ribbing you about is asking a forum mod to do something game related, they don't work on the game, they only work on the forums. Edited November 10, 2015 by Gomly | |} ---- Oh I love draken as well. Just realized I said here instead of "her" doh me. Then how about Amazon Thighs or Savage Thighs?......I think I might have a fixation..... I've never really been true to the naming thing though. I will spend hours getting the right look for my character and then name my character like something I said above. Or after food items. | |} ---- ---- ---- Hah! We'd love to help but sadly, that is not something we can do directly. We've forwarded your request to our team that handles that, though. ;) -Team WildStar | |} ---- Pretty much all of W* lore is "Rule of Cool" canonized. I find it odd that you'd single out this particular offense in the sea of possibilities :P | |} ---- That was actually done by the Darkspur Cartel, who're terrorizing the town. You drive them out of the town and save the poor Exile civilians. | |} ---- Much appreciated d-(^.^)z | |} ---- Ah, shows how much attention I was paying to the storyline doesn't it :P . | |} ---- Actually this is the beginning of a regional story line that explains it all, so if you finish that story line it really explains a lot more. It's unclear if the Darkspur cartel came from one faction or the other it just seems they attack the Exiles more often. | |} ---- I imagine they're able to get away with a lot more on Exile side since there is a much weaker central government. I only recall seeing them once in Auroria Dom side, before the shared zones. Edited November 11, 2015 by ZuberiGF | |} ---- The Dominion has them more or less on the run and they stay away from the core worlds because of it. On the Dominion version of the Gauntlet you actually get recruited to take down the Cartel game show site by Agent Lex (who is waiting for you at the end of the Shiphand). One price of anarchy is that you don't have a a strong centralized military machine to deal with groups like the Cartel, so the Exiles *generally* feel the brunt of their shenanigans. | |} ---- ----